Oakwood Tunnel Park. Windsor-Essex Parkway
Windsor-Essex Parkway and Greenlink. Some Perspective
Our Civic Leaders do not seem to know when to throw the towel in. Painful to watch and stressing to think that they are blowing our tax dollars off and into the wind. This past weekend Windsor Star subcribers found their papers fully gift wrapped with Greenlink propaganda. Front page, back cover and both inside covers. Black plus one colour. For the record that ad placement cost city tax payers $20,000.00 plus agency fees which were probably half of that again. We have now seen several full page ads at five grand each and lets not forget all of the billboards around town which cost about two thousand dollars a pop per month. There's transit Windsor advertising which doesn't come cheap, radio ads, two batches of car flags (the first ones didn't cut the mustard so new ones were ordered at duplicate cost), mail in cards with all of the pre-paid postage fees, magazine ads and who knows what else. We are talking hundreds of thousands of advertising dollars; our local tax dollars. Dollars which we paid and which are quite frankly gone for good and to no good end.
Here's a bit of perspective which local bloggers have been pointing out for over a week. CKLW ran an opinion poll last week and the results easily revealed that over 60 percent of respondents agreed that the Windsor-Essex Parkway is a good way to go. The cost of that poll was zero dollars, nada dinero, zip and zilch. Think about that. CKLW's poll which costed nothing and ran for a mere three days told us where Windsorites stand on this issue. Our City Leaders have spent hundreds of thousands of dollars over the past few months and are still spending even after the Windsor-Essex Parkway has been chosen. All of that spending and they still don't have any concensus. All of the ad dollars which our fearless leaders burned off between their knuckles could have been thrown into real causes like libraries, infrastructure, trees, or paying down debt. Heck...that money could have been used to promote Windsor to the rest of the world. The saddest part about all of this is that it may be all for not because, as we have been hearing lately, neither the state of Michigan or the Federal U.S. government have signed onto having a new border crossing citing unecessary cost and seeming satisfaction with the already under way twinning of the Ambassador Bridge.
Tunnel Vision
The Greenlink and the Windsor-Essex Parkway share the same path and footprint. They straddle the same neighbourhoods and municipalities and they start and stop at exactly the same points. That part is easy enough to envision. The Boys and Girls of Council have their knickers in knots over tunnels. For whatever rationalle, they are bent on longer tunnels. Why? Because they can cover them with more park land. Again: Why? Here is some perspective. Think about the tunnel that we know. The Detroit-Windsor Tunnel. It is 1,573 meters long. Roughly one mile. Now envision the last time you drove through that tunnel. Not a very short tunnel is it. Greenlink proponents are pushing for 3830 meters of tunneling with three proposed tunnels being almost as long as the Detroit-Windsor Tunnel. There is no logical or safe purpose for this. They don't guard against pollution (in fact it concentrates and exhausts it into the very neighbourhoods which the tunnels abut. At least with open roadway those pollutants get mixed with fresh air and carried away by prevailing winds. The Greenlink tunnels have no emergency shoulders either. That means if there is an accident in one of those tunnels the best scenario we have is traffic backups for miles. Worst case scenario is mass carnage as we saw in the California tunnel disaster of last year. http://video.msn.com/video.aspx?mkt=en-US&brand=msnbc&showPlaylist=true&playlist=videoByUuids:uuids:b55fa02b-b490-46f9-8f8c-1f113df7c991
As for parkland how much is enough? The Windsor-Essex Parkway is providing 240 acres of parkland. Most of that new parkland will be Labelle with 240 meters, Huron Church with 220 meters, Hearthwood with 220 meters, Howard with 240 meters and Spring Garden with 220 meters. Let's look at this in perspective. Square 240 meters and you get 16 acres. That's just the amount of greenspace which covers one tunnel. It does not take into account the greenspace which it joins to on either side of the highway. Memorial Park and Optimist Parks combined are 50 acres. Lansberry Park is 11 acres. Multiply 15 acres times 11 tunnels plus the peripheral green spaces and you get a lot of added green with all of the bonus trails and ammenities attached. Are sour grapes really worth the whining, kicking and fiscal hemorrhaging which our City Council is subjecting us to? Over 60 percent of us have already said no.
The Nafta Super Highway
Chew on this: Right from the beginning the Nafta Superhighway has been mapped out from Mexico and beyond via the I-69 straight through PortHuron/Sarnia and directly to London and Toronto via the 402/401. At this time, construction has already begun in the Southernmost affected states. This highway is planned to be four football fields wide. As we know, the involved governments are already planning to widen the 402. The next time you have your road map of South Western Ontario out take a hard look at it. If you think that Canada stops at London today, think about the impact of this new path of least resistance. Windsor will certainly come to know what it's like to be Wallaceburg.
27 comments:
Happy Mothersday MOM! For the record, Jackson Park, Memorial and Lansberry Parks come to 128 acres total. About half of the DRIC acreage. Where's Wallaceburg?
Wallaceburg is 20 minutes north of Chatham. It used be asmall city that produced glass, lots of it. Today it has very little manufacturing left.
Windsor has spent $4.2 million on lawyers, over $800,000 on greenlink ads and pretended that we will have phenomenal parks if greenlink were to be built. Plus add in the disregard of their own by-laws in Council Chambers with the greenlink advertisment in front of the king.
Since King Eddie and Council decided to slash the parks & recs budget just how does Windsor expect to upkeep these hundreds of acres? Addie stated himself on both CKWL and in the Windsor Star "that it doesn't cost a lot of money to cut grass and trim a few bushes."
If you think we are going to get parks that resemble those glossy drawings (with lakes and brigdes) I have some swamp land to sell in Essex County.
To ME...
I have to agree that neither the DRIC nor the Greenlink will ever get off the ground. I also haven't trusted architechtural renderings for many years. They seem to always be for the "pitch" only. I am amazed at this point that any of our elected officials think that their seats will be waiting for them next time around. This council has to go down in history as the most clueless and diserving group ever.
throw in the towel??? No...
I, and others that live under, next to, around or near the Ambassador Bridge will accecpt nothing less than a tunneled solution for the last mile.
If our provincial elected representatives were truly on our side, none of this advertising would be necessary. It is sad because when the American DRIC pulls out in the 11th hour, there will be no choice but to finish the last mile... I have lost all respect for the provincial liberals. They have failed to manage the middle income taxpayers. It seems the high income taxpayers are always being managed effectivly.
ps. the ABC can't pass an EA, what kind of trickery will be used to get by that one?
Indianroad, how do you know the ABC won't pass the EA? It hasn't been completed.
Like they're going to build anything. You can't build a bridge if they don't want it on the other side of the river. If there's no bridge, there's no Greenlink or DRIC. Maybe that's why Eddie wants to beautify the City all of a sudden. Diversion or his ass is grass.
Mayor of Monmouth with a lot of one-sided rhetoric and faulty logic.
Bringing up tunnel fires! Really MoM, you're going to have to do better than that.
Greenlink is far and away the best solution.
Windsor STAY FIRM! Accept nothing less than the BEST SOLUTION! MoM wants to roll over and let Windsor get SHIT ON with a 4th-rate project -- DONT HELP HIM DO IT!
To anonymous 3:
I'd like to hear from you, or any others, why and how the Greenlink proposal is better. I am pragmatic by nature but if there is good logic or argument for Greenlink you have a shot at persuading me.
Please though...Try to regard my rule above. If an explicative is required mask it out a bit. F#@S!!!
Thanks.
Remember the last time the City was shown pretty pictures? Just take a look at the Canderel building and ask yourself if we are really going get whats in the pictures. I say run the roads right up to the bridge and let someone else build a second span. This is already costing us to much time and effort. And if people want to go down fighting it, let them go down. If they can't see the writing on the wall by now, who are we to educate them.
STOP THE MADNESS! Can't Windsor/Detroit just do something, and do it quickly? We need to accept that Windsor/Detroit will never be a cosmopolitan city in the true sense. Casino galore (with friends/family that gamble all away), a couple universities (more recognized US), and diminishing major automotive industries. OK, and some great Italian restaurants. It's time to S*** or get off the pot. Speaking of S***, remember, we pay so much to live in this fine city, don't flush it away....
Me and Kirby... if you guys bear with me I can show/prove why Greenlink with it's own crossing far west is way better than the last mile. the last mile being EC Row and Huronline to a twin. the DRIC plan only goes to Huronline and EC Row. yes it has 3 crossings. one of which they say they picked. but this is only the Canadian side. The American DRIC has 15 locations they are choosing. Lets face it, look across the river and see the Americans are not building a new crossing far west, they are building the gateway project to a twin... Soon they will clue us in that the American DRIC will announce they will not build yet, cause the traffic is down. But they will hold all the property so they will be ready in comming years to build when traffic warrants.
what shape will we be in at that point?
The Canadian DRIC will have shovels in the ground with approvals to complete the DRIC up to EC Row and Huron Line... Well which crossing will we pick since the Americans are not in yet. We can't build half a bridge.
Hence the last mile...
Me's question was: Indianroad, how do you know the ABC won't pass the EA? It hasn't been completed...
OK I got the proof.
The DRIC did do a very extensive Air Quality assessment. I will post the results. These are current test from Aug 2007 for the west side of Windsor.
when you see that the DRIC projections are up to 11x the NOx by the year 2035 within 250 meters from thre property line of a new plaza far west. These figures are also the same for 250 meters from the edge of the highway. The DRIC has not passed their own EA unless you count the above as a pass. In America/Mighigan they call that "non attainable" in Canada they use the Build /No Build scenario...That is why they say the new build will be better than no build because, the current bridge opperation without a twin, air pollution wise, is above the limit that Canada's own laws forbid... This is why the DRIC ruled out the Ambassador twin from it's lineup in the first place...
if you guys think that the CURRENT air problem has nothing to do with Diesel exhaust and more to do with Zug island and Edison, check out these findings that I will post at the end.
That is why I wanted another EA carried out on Michigan's impact on Essex, that way with the DRIC EA we will know everything...
They don't want to do that cause then we will know for sure what diesel exhaust is doing to us in Windsor...
There's only one problem... The DRIC had to do a complex Air Analysis as per Canadian law. and so MUST the ABC for a twin...
you guys tell me if the Ambassador Bridge Twin will pass...
here goes
Area of Investigation
For assessment of the potential affects on air quality of
the Access Road Alternatives and Crossing Alternatives, an area located within 250 m on either side of the Right of Way (ROW) of each proposed Alternative was studied. Similar to the connecting route alternatives, the Plaza Alternatives were assessed within 250 m of the proposed facility property lines.
These are c/p from the DRIC draft issued August 2007...
5.2.1 PM2.5 Concentrations
As can be seen in Table 5.2, the maximum predicted PM2.5 concentrations at 50 m
away from the property boundary increase by a factor of 2X to more than 3X the No Build concentrations in each of the horizon years for all four plaza options. The changes at all distance intervals from the boundary were shown earlier in
Table 4.11, and are significant at 250 m for all Plaza Alternatives and all horizon
years. Similarly, all of the Plaza Alternatives result in a significant increase the
number of days predicted to exceed the CWS at 100 m away, in comparison to
No Build.
_____________________________________________________
5.2.2 NOX Concentrations
All of the plaza alternatives have a significant impact on the air quality in the immediate vicinity of the property boundaries. The maximum predicted 1-hour NOX concentrations at 50 m away from the property boundary increase by as much as a factor of 6X in 2015, 9X in 2025 and almost 11X in 2035, in comparison to the No Build concentrations for all four plaza options. The
increases in concentration are significant at distances up to 250m from the property boundary, for all Plaza Alternatives, and all horizon years.
___________________________________________________________
The results from the Crossing Alternatives / Connecting Roadways are similar to
those seen for the Access Road Alternatives. However, the Crossings and
connecting roads are elevated, and thus the emissions behave a little differently
than ground level sources.
____________________________________________
5.3.1 PM2.5 Concentration
As can be seen in Table 5.2, the maximum predicted PM2.5 concentrations at 50 m
away from the ROW of the Crossings and connecting roadways increase by a factor of 1.5 - 2X the No Build concentrations in each of the horizon years for the
three crossing options. Table 4.13 presented the changes at all distance intervals from the boundary, and are significant at 250 m for all Crossing Alternatives and all horizon years. All of the Crossing Alternatives result in a significant increase the number of days predicted to exceed the CWS at 100 m away, in comparison
to No Build._______________________________________________
5.3.2 NOX Concentrations
The maximum predicted 1-hour NOX concentrations increase by more than a factor of 2X in comparison to the No Build concentrations at 50 m away from the ROW by 2035. The increases in concentration are significant (> 10%) at
distances up to 250 m away, for all Alternatives, and all horizon years. Similar to the results of the Access Road Alternatives, there are no exceedances of the MOE 1-hour NOx criterion in the vicinity of the Crossings / Connecting Roadway.
_______________________________________________________
2.2 Assessment Criteria
Environment Canada and the Ontario Ministry of the Environment (MOE) have
set air quality objectives, and air quality standards and criteria, respectively for
various air pollutants.
Ontario Regulation 419 (O.Reg.419) of the Ontario Environmental Protection Act (EPA) defines maximum concentration levels for various air contaminants at a
Point of Impingement (POI), arising from an industrial facility or similar operation. The POI is generally defined as the off property location where the maximum concentration resulting from a facility emission occurs. However, if
there is a child care facility, health care facility, senior’s home or educational facility on the property in question these locations become the designated POI location.
_________________________________________________
above partial documents were taken from this link...
http://www.partnershipborderstudy.com/pdf/DRAFT_AirQualityImpactAssessment_ReportAug2007.pdf
_____________________________________________
"The combined weight of scientific evidence from this new CATF diesel exposure study along with the existing medical studies supports the conclusion that exposure to diesel exhaust during commutes poses a serious public health risk that needs to be addressed"
No Escape from Diesel Exhaust:
How to Reduce Commuter Exposure (Clean Air Task Force 2007)
The Clean Air Task Force (CATF) investigated the levels of diesel particles during commutes in several cities. They found that regardless of how you get to work, there is no escape from exposure to diesel exhaust, and that pollution levels measured inside cars, buses, and trains during commutes were many times greater than levels in the outdoor air in these cities at that same time. The combined weight of scientific evidence from this new CATF diesel exposure study along with the existing medical studies supports the conclusion that exposure to diesel exhaust during commutes poses a serious public health risk that needs to be addressed.
Foreword
Exposure to diesel exhaust is part of our everyday lives. We encounter diesel-powered vehicles, and the air pollution they create, each day. This occurs in our neighborhoods where diesel-powered vehicles make deliveries or pick up trash, or when we drive behind them during our daily rounds to the store or travel on a highway. Most often, Americans are exposed to diesel pollution on their way
to and from work or school, whether commuting via a car, riding on diesel buses and trains, or on foot or bike near a busy thoroughfare.
In thousands of medical studies, scientists have documented serious adverse health impacts from the air pollutants resulting from diesel exhaust. Our own studies at New York University have linked diesel pollution exposures to higher incidences of asthma in New York City communities. One of the most dangerous of these diesel emissions is carbonaceous particulate matter, or fine particle soot.
Diesel particles are very tiny in comparison to many other atmospheric particles. They are so small, in fact, that they can even penetrate from the lungs into the bloodstream, carrying with them other toxic substances. Some health researchers have estimated that such fine particles are responsible for shortening the lives of at least 70,000 Americans each year, and studies have also associated this pollution with a host of other serious adverse health impacts, such as asthma attacks. Scientists now
even have evidence that these very tiny particles may disrupt normal heart rhythms and cause inflammation leading to cardiovascular problems, such as heart attacks and stroke.
Given the potentially severe health dangers posed by diesel exhaust, it is important to ask: When are we most exposed to these deadly particles? Findings in published, peer-reviewed health research estimate that, although we spend only about six percent of our day commuting to and from work, over half of our exposure to these particles may occur during that travel time.
The Clean Air Task Force (CATF), using the same type of monitoring instruments and scientific methodologies presently used by health researchers at major universities, has investigated the levels of diesel particles during commutes in several cities. These investigators measured pollutant levels during commutes by car, transit bus, commuter train, ferry, and while walking. They found that regardless of how you get to work, there is no escape from exposure to diesel exhaust, and that pollution levels measured inside cars, buses, and trains during commutes were many times greater than levels in the outdoor air in these cities at that same time. The combined weight of scientific evidence from this new CATF diesel exposure study along with the existing medical studies supports the conclusion that exposure to diesel exhaust during commutes poses a serious public health risk that needs to be addressed.
Study blames 20,000 deaths a year on diesel exhaust
WASHINGTON (AP) — Emissions from old diesel engines cause more than 20,000 Americans a year to die sooner than they would have otherwise, an environmental group estimated Tuesday.
For gasoline and diesel vehicles, the pollutants of primary concern are particulate matter (PM), nitrogen oxides (NOx), and ozone produced from the NOx and VOC’s that their engines emit.
All three of these pollutants can have primary negative health effects. There have been Various studies performed demonstrating
a link between exposure to diesel exhaust and increased lung cancer occurrences. A national estimate of cancer risk from diesel exhaust found that it is the #1 air toxics cancer risk in the U.S.
Breathing particulate matter (PM) in the most polluted U.S. cities poses the same risk as living with a smoker according to a 2002 American Cancer Society study.
I will continue to add suporting documents...
scientists have documented serious adverse health impacts from the air pollutants resulting from diesel exhaust
Ontario cancer statistics
In 2007, an estimated 26,900 people will die of cancer in Ontario, and 59,500 new cases will be diagnosed.
The most frequently diagnosed cancer overall in Ontario is lung cancer. An estimated 7,900 people (4,000 men; 3,900 women) will be diagnosed with lung cancer in 2007.
Lung cancer is the overall leading cause of cancer death in Ontario. An estimated 6,800 people (3,600 men; 3,200 women) will die of lung cancer in 2007. IN ONTARIO... see... www.cancer.ca___________
________________________________________________
Binational Great Lakes Urban Regions
(Detroit-Windsor, Port Huron-Sarnia, and Sault Ste. Maries)
A Report from the
International Air Quality Advisory Board to the
International Joint Commission
February 2004 ISBN 1-894280-44-X
Findings:
i) While the data reviewed were not the most current nor comprehensive, it is clear that, in all three regions, during episodes that occur with some
frequency, particularly in the summer months, smog
(ozone and fine particulate) achieves levels that would affect the well being of the entire population and have an immediate, pronounced negative impact
on the most sensitive elements of the populations – youth and the elderly. Similar conditions are evident in the past few years and appear to persist to this day.
_____________________________________________
congradulations to anyone who read all that.
can you see more clearly now?
Currently, the Ambassador Bridge Company claims it's only a replacement span. and have applied to the EA as a replacement span... here is their original plan from 1997. do you think it ends up being a replacement span?
if you can get a good air photo, which you can't... you would see their whole plan developing... Looks like the way the plaza's are designed they are perfect for one way bridges. A seperate process that's going on is a staging area in Brighton Beach. For this staging area which will have so many trucks that they will have to be metered on to Huron Church. well that won't do because the Ambassador Bridge Company has ideas to have a second mega highway from Brighton Beach down Sandwich to Prince road then a left from Prince onto the area between the tracks and Bloomfield(the ABC has allready purchased all the homes within 50 meters along this second coridoor). this coridoor leads to the lands behind McDonnalds that can hold another 100 customs booths.
once the last mile is going this second route will just appear...
The West Side will be a tangled swirling web of superhighways.
don't you think we deserve a tunnel. one that can at least redirect the fumes to portals farther away. The DRIC doesn't do that, only Greenlink attempts it.
And it appears the provincial Government has no wish to curb air pollution because of this 12 year old plan they have with ABC...a plan that is far outdated to ever be world class.
I don't know in my opinion we can't let them build the last mile/miles at grade or even depressed. EC Row will be overrun. to boot...
EDITORIALS
BRIDGE FIRM EYES BIRTH OF A TWIN
The Windsor Star By Douglas Williamson, Star Business Editor March 29, 1997
Preliminary groundwork is being laid for a second span alongside the Ambassador Bridge.
It's been the stuff of urban myth in Windsor and Detroit for years.
Now, the prospect of a second bridge spanning the murky Detroit River has taken on the air of reality.
There are developments on two fronts:
- Ambassador Bridge owners and Michigan state and local governments are officially planning preliminary groundwork for a span alongside the current structure, tied initially to freeway renovations in Detroit.
- A rival Windsor group is quietly but vigorously working on its own bridge proposal, according to sources who do not want to be identified. "There is a serious interest out there for a second bridge," said a Windsor official. "Obviously there's a competitive situation lining up." The group has engaged the services of a city surveying firm which also refuses to comment.
At various times in the last two decades, rumors have had a new bridge coming to Amherstburg or Windsor. Reports surfaced again in the early 1990s, when cross-border shopping was the rage.
But no one has seen any evidence of groundwork such as land assembly, said Doug Lawson, chairman of the Windsor-Essex County Development Commission, adding that the commission has received no information on a bridge proposal.
Company cautious
For its part, the Ambassador Bridge company is playing it cautious.
"We've always said that when traffic warrants it, we will consider building a second span," said Remo Mancini, president of the Canadian Transit Company, one of two firms owned by the U.S. family that owns the bridge. He said it could be 15 years before the need for a new bridge becomes acute.
"You don't want to wait until you have traffic jams before you start planning for the future," the former Liberal Essex South MPP added.
As part of a $100-million US overhaul of the tangled entrance to the Detroit road and connecting freeway system, a larger new ramp/deck will permit the later addition of a twin to the Ambassador Bridge.
Second ramp
During planning sessions, bridge owners asked that the new deck accommodate a ramp that can veer west toward a second bridge, said consultant Pat Holland of The Corradino Group of Louisville, Ky., which is overseeing the urgently needed freeway-bridge entrance renovations for a consortium of state and local governments and the bridge company.
"I think that says that it's been thought about at a relatively high level," Holland told The Star. "We were instructed and we've (designed) an approach, that will handle one bridge or two bridges.
"They're the ones who initiated that discussion, but it was obvious to everyone that if we're going to build something for the next 30 or 40 years, that you'd have to have it so it can accommodate a second bridge if one were built.
"The bridge company did in fact say that they would prefer it if they had that option open. It can easily accommodate another bridge just down-river which is west of the present bridge. We can accommodate it within 150 or 200 yards probably," Holland said.
"We're building an access ramp up to the bridge and part of our directive has been to build that ramp such that it could serve another bridge if another bridge was built, and that is part of our charge and we're designing it in that fashion.
"So based on what we've done, we could accommodate a second bridge.
"The place where you build it, is land that they own," he said, referring to bridge company-owned property on both sides of the river. "It's my belief that the existing bridge would become one-way toward the U.S. and the new bridge become one-way toward Canada. That means that the traffic now going over this (planned) deck on to the present bridge would divert on to a new bridge."
The U.S. federal government will pay 80 per cent of the cost of the freeway-bridge entrance renovations, and the Ambassador Bridge company the remaining 20 per cent, Holland said. Interim work should begin later this year but no date has been set for completion of the entire job, necessary to improve what is acknowledged to be one of the worst international freeway access points in North America.
"We've building a new access to the Ambasador Bridge from the interstate systems. There are three interstates plus a lot of local streets that all try to get on the Ambassador Bridge at the same point, which makes it look like a bowl of spaghetti," Holland said. The improvements, including the new deck, will allow vastly improved car and truck traffic flow from the bridge to local Detroit streets and connecting freeways.
Regarding the new deck, preliminary design and planning is done, actual design will begin this summer, and construction could start in a year and half, Holland said.
In the freeway-bridge entrance redesign, the new deck is to be built over existing businesses and roads, Holland said. END
© 1996-2008 The Ambassador Bridge
Our Civic Leaders do not seem to know when to throw the towel in...
they can't. they don't want the last mile either... the mayor has always been on our side but the Ambassador Bridge Company seems to have infiltrated our Provincial Government with Sandra Pupotelo and Dwight Duncan, don't forget our last MPP's Remo Mancini and Susan Whealon. for years they have been working on this and they are not going to let the mayor build Greenlink and when the American DRIC pulls out that will be the proof... So the Provincial Government has been using us as pawns. all the money Eddie spent is useless.
Now can you see the reason to fight them in court???
looks like it must be done...
CHRIS SCHNUUR...
has a serious ajenda... concerning the Ambassador Bridge.
some proof may be that you are removed from his blog roll again...
Oh Well, he wouldn't let me post a comment in awhile. even a one liner.
Seems boring over there since he started sensoring everything. Only a couple yes men hanging around as far as I can tell...
He's not interested in democracy as he once claimed. Or he would let me say my piece.
To Indian Road...
Carpel Tunnel Syndrome can be a bitch...
Good points. From watching various dialogue I don't think that you and Schnurr get each other. F.Y.I...There are no issues with Schnurr. Our views are very similar.
Why don't you send me an e-mail: MOMnews@hotmail.com
I'd appreciate more perspective from your vantage.
Indian Road!...
What would you say to doing a guest blog wherin you can state your whole position etc? Whatever you want. Same as Councillor Postma did. If you want to give it a go let me know. Either in this forum or by e-mail: MOMnews@hotmail.com
Anonymous 3 is obviously a betting person. The California tunnel fire of last year happened in a tunnel which was only 600 meters long. The Greenlink tunnels are all above a 1000 meters long. They are going to be dedicated to non-stop traffic at high speeds. Perhaps Anon 3 could give us the odds so that we might divert useless deaths like the ones from the California disaster.
Are you going to start spouting about the supposed North American Union next?
Good Lord, get out the tinfoil hats.
Anyway, it's so funny how these local webloggers claim to care so much about the city but then have no problem supporting an obviously inferior plan.
Bloggers have shown that they do care about what's best for the city. By and large they spend a considerable amount of time analysing and/or researching a subject before posting. And usually their commentary is boiled down to elements and questions that incite further thought and dialogue on an issue. Hence this forum. For instance this blog post wasn't about DRIC vs. Greenlink. That's already over and done with. One intention of this post was to point out how much money is being blown off after the fact. As ME pointed out earlier in this thread, the price tag for Greenlink advertising is already at $800,000.00 and still climbing. That's a lot of coin. A lot of very tangeable and immediate improvements could be achieved with this cash. There is some speculation out there that this ad campaign is actually working against Greenlink. Think about this: If neither Greenlink or the DRIC proposals were considered or built how many people would have even noticed. What major city in North America doesn't have major highways running through them. Need we look farther than Toronto or Detroit for examples? Someone else also pointed out that all of this commotion about either proposal has escalated on top of a steam bubble anyway. It is very true that American governments are not even thinking about endorsing a second border crossing(for very sound reasons) and as we all know...they are already building all highways to the existing bridge crossing site for a twin span already in the making and at no cost to tax payers.
Let's get back to bloggers. As many as there are out here they still don't have the general publics ear by a longshot. Very few people tune in to blogs compared to traditional news sources and a considerable segment of the population still isn't even connected to cyber-space. They aren't even affected by what bloggers have to say. The cited CKLW poll is good proof that bloggers are only a representative slice of how the general population trends on the subject.
So...with all of that said...here are a couple questions which the last anonymous commenter (or anyone for that matter)should ponder:
1) All things considered, what makes the Greenlink proposal better than the Parkway proposal?
2) Are Windsor residents being sold on the word "Green"? In other words: Do you think there might be an element of "Greenwash" which we might be buying into?
3) Can tax payers afford to be burdened with either a 2.6 billion dollar tab or even the cost to maintain such an endeavor after the fact?
The challenge for all of us is to seek out all of the information we can about the entire subject and then make up our minds based on that. One thing which you will find out for sure. Bloggers have already been there.
yea I know it does seem like all that money(and there's a lot of it)is going up in smoke...
It's really not fair to judge Greenlink/the Parkway. kind of like apples and oranges.
Greenlink is a new plaza and crossing design. as well as a few upgrades to the Parkway design.
The Parkway is nothing more than a diesel ditch leading to the last mile... another diesel ditch. and don't forget Bloomfield.
Greenlink had better ideas, in my opinion. because the Parkway is what it is...The Parkway is a 1950design, thought up in the early 90's and is far from World Class and has no regard for human health or residential growth or even industrial growth, lately.
We deserve better, don't you think?
I'm sorry anonymous, the fact is yes the North American Union Scares me a little. check the price of oil lately?
One more union to go... the Arab union.
Tell us how Greenlink is any different from the Parkway. How is it better for human health? What is more modern about it? How is it better for surrounding communities? For the extra bit of tunneling and parkland that it offers is it worth the extra billion dollars? They are both "diesel ditches". One just has more money thrown at it to spruce it up. A pig with lipstick.
What good is a Parkway or a Greenlink without a river crossing? Is another bridge even needed? Let's see what really happens in 2009?
the Mayor has his JackHammer out...
May 26 2008
YO.... monday night council meeting... and... the provincial government domnated DRIC announcement...
Ha. It was the best show I ever saw...
If you like Canadian Democracy in action?
BRAVO...
congratulations to the Canadians who wrote our strong, ever reaching and resorceful Canadian Environmental Assessment Act...
congratulations to the Canadians who will now enforce our strong, ever reaching and resorceful Environmental Assessment Act...
And Congratulations to the many people with the forsite to see the black letters.
and to all the people who worked very hard to penitrate the smoke and mirrors of the DRIC government machine.
and Congratulations to the Mayor for his outstanding perserverance.
I think you can watch it again this saturday morning on Cable 11 @ 8:00am.
you will get to see all the DRIC team succome to an all out attack on whether or not Greenlink was better in EVERY area they claimed to be. You will get to see serious admissions of failure from the DRIC members, you will get to see mistake after mistake after mistake admitted to by the DRIC and the proof... You will get to see possible reasons and motivation for these failures and best of all you will get to see the magnificent job the composers of our Canadian Environmental Assessment did.
were not out of the woods yet. ABC will never give up, and have good reasons not to. and have further plans for us west siders.
indianroad: Simply accept that Windsor's eighty-year-old border crossings need to be replaced.
Simply accept that stalling construction of new border infrastructure will only increase the costs of ANY border-related project. You talk about the price of oil as if the price of oil will have no impact on the cost of the Greenlink proposal. How are bulldozers and tunnel borers powered? How is construction equipment transported to and from job sites?
You and everyone else living in Windsor have been lied to. How long did it take Mayor Francis and his team of lawyers and consultants and engineers to admit that the ORIGINAL cost estimate for Greenlink was completely inaccurate?
You present your arguments as if the Ambassador Bridge Company creates pollution. You live in the automotive capital of Canada and next to the automotive capital of the world. This region is full of drivers. Like it or not, OUR driving habits pollute OUR environment.
You've expressed a willingness to accept an expropriation. Why not just pursue that? Many Windsorites want public money.
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